Some on the Left, and even a number of Left Libertarians have tried to argue that the proposed Ground Zero Mosque is not at Ground Zero, at all, but "a few blocks away."
This from reporter Ben Smith of Politico this morning, about halfway through his piece, "GOP takes harsher stance toward Islam" (emphasis added):
But the attacks on what is now nationally known as the "Ground Zero mosque" —it is a few blocks north of the site — also stand in for a broader turn in the cultural politics of the right...The property line for the Burlington Coat factory is 600 feet from the Ground Zero construction site.
The second photo shows a part of the landing gear from the first plane to hit the Twin Towers, that rammed through the roof of the Burlington Coat factory. 
According to various dictionaries "a few" is undefined and inexact, but more than one. Moreover, numerous language experts at the UK's Yahoo Answers concur with the following:* a couple is exactly twoFrom the aerial photo, the area of destruction on 9/11 is one block away from Burlington. It is two blocks from the property line of the World Trade Center complex. Politico and others using the adjective "a few" to describe what is clearly one block, two if you count only the WTC complex, are making quite a stretch indeed.
* a few is three, rarely four
* several is at least three but small, not exceeding five
Photo hat tips Pamela Geller at Atlas Shrugs, and KingShamus.
84 comments:
The mosque is going to get built I'm OK with it. So can you please find something interesting to post.
My gut feeling is BOTH the American left and right are being used by radical Islam. The radicals may have no intention at all of building a Mosque. The radicals need an evil Christian or Jewish boogeyman to beat on in order to play to their political base. Pretending to want to build a Mosque and then showcasing the American reaction plays into their propaganda.
Charles, how thoroughly dissapointing. This is the most important issue of the year; could be one of the most important issues of our lifetime, save 9/11 itself.
How in the bloody hell can you say, you're "okay with it." My gosh man. Do you have any love for your country?
I have to serious call into question your patriotism.
As an American male, did you serve in the Military?
Gary, you're reading way, way, way too much into this. This battle is much simpler than that.
This is a clear cut case of good vs. evil. These Radical Muslims want to plant the flag of victory on our soil. And people like Charles, are "Ok with it."
Perhaps Charles is just pissed, cause these photos show his side is dead wrong on this issue.
Kind of in your face, 'eh Charles? Right there in black and white. Undeniable.
Hey Charles... let's post a photo of your bent-over ass as you pray in the new mosque. You might find both the mosque and your mug interesting, but the rest of us know there is a bloody war on.
Eric - linked you.
**** This is a clear cut case of good vs. evil ****
This is also a propaganda war and the American reaction plays into the hands of the radicals helping them to build their base.
This is the Moslem version of playing the "race card" to whip up their followers. We should be careful not fall into their propaganda trap.
Gary, the only way Muslims win is if we show weakness.
Look dude, don't tell me about Muslims. I spend 4 years of my life in the United States Navy, on two different ships, and most of that time was spent in the Middle East (Persian Gulf, I.O. and Gulf of Aden.)
I speak basic Arabic.
I've spent time with Muslims in Bahrain. I've eaten meals with them. I've talked with them extensively.
They are all about the "strongest horse."
What do you think "Hussein" means?
If they sense any weakness in their enemies they will immediately go for the jugular.
The only way to fight Radical Islam is to be just as mean, feroicious, underhanded, and nasty as they are.
So stop with the "propoganda" bullshit. We are at War. And we either win this thing, or we will be dead!
Soooo if those who want to build this center are on the side of EVIL!!!! then you are essentially calling Jews evil, too. This center couldn't have been built without the sale of and support of the original property owner: a Jewish-American by the name of Stephen Pomerantz. Most Jewish organizations have spoken in favor of the Cordoba center, too. So have many Christian organizations. Maybe your objection to this is simply based on a hatred for all of the Abrahamic religions and the Semitic people who established them...Just putting that out there.
**** And we either win this thing, or we will be dead! ****
ALERT . . . You cannot "win" a war that is unwinnable. People have fought Islam since 610AD. Radical Islam is not going away. The best you can do work with friendly Islamic nations like Egypt, Indonesia, Pakistan, Turkey or Morocco to build a network of friends.
Throwing red meat and white hot rhetoric around may make the 5 o'clock news but it will not build the Moslem alliances we need around the world.
By foot, the site of Cordoba House is two blocks from the edge of the WTC complex.
By car, it is four blocks (because of one way streets, you have to drive three blocks then circle back a block).
Very nice graphic, which confirms what I just wrote and also shows the 21-story building and the 15-story building that separate "Ground Zero" from what will be a 13-story building.
Eric Dondero is right about one thing -- this is an important issue, at least in terms of determining who might be a libertarian and who definitely isn't. If you favor using the force of government to stop the project, you aren't one. Period.
By the way, if you really were familiar with Arabic, as you've claimed before, you'd know that the Cordoba community center really is considered a razz in the face of Islamists due to the way that it mixes a prayer room and a theatre and a recreation area all in one building. The Islamists, like their Christianist counterparts, don't believe in allowing men and women to mingle freely and engage in such scandalous acts such as dancing and playing sports together.
Not allowing the center would be the greatest gift you folks could give to the Islamists. Of course, since Eric's philosophy is usually nearly identical to theirs, I'm not surprised that he'd support what they'd want Americans to do.
Eric Dondero is right about one thing -- this is an important issue, at least in terms of determining who might be a libertarian and who definitely isn't. If you favor using the force of government to stop the project, you aren't one. Period.
Wrong, Kn@ppster. Your definition of libertarian is much like Gary's definition of Republican: extreme.
Kn@ppster,
Well, it's good to see America's sexiest libertarian is still posting here! Yeah, I agree. Using the government to shut down the building of an establishment simply because one doesn't like what the people will be doing inside is antithetical to all of what libertarianism really is. I'd support their right to build even if they were opening up a museum dedicated to the KKK or a brothel or a multi-story marijuana grow-house.
The Islamists, like their Christianist counterparts, don't believe in allowing men and women to mingle freely and engage in such scandalous acts such as dancing and playing sports together.
Have you been to many churches, bint? Otherwise, you'd know that there are Christians who engage in dancing and sports; I play softball as a member of my church's team.
Of course, since Eric's philosophy is usually nearly identical to theirs, I'm not surprised that he'd support what they'd want Americans to do.
Why am I not surprised you would say that?
Ran,
I appreciate your adoration of photos of bent-over male asses, but what does that have to do with the Cordoba center? I mean, as far as I can tell, nobody is waging a war against your right to love male asses.
Morgan,
Christianists=/=Christians
Islamists=/=Muslims
Reading fail!
I seriously doubt it, bint. I've been in churches belonging to fundamentalist denominations, and believe it or not, they allow dancing and sports. When they started, they didn't allow it, but they changed their ways.
Know of any fundamentalist Muslims who have done the same?
Morgan,
by the way, I went last night. We're kind of a Saturday night service kind of family. My daughter and her friends like Saturday night services, because they can gather for coffee and hang out in the lounge afterward without having to worry about the sort of dangers that a lot of teens get into on the weekends when there are that many of them in one place.
Did you make it to church this weekend or were you busy practicing being a psychic? My church frowns on that sort of thing, but if yours is okay with it, then who am I to judge!
Did you make it to church this weekend or were you busy practicing being a psychic? My church frowns on that sort of thing, but if yours is okay with it, then who am I to judge!
Went this morning (Lutheran), and frankly, I'm wondering where you come up with stuff like being psychic? Good for you that you and your family go to church; it's a shame you don't know enough about Christian churches in general.
Morgan,
doubt whatever you want. There are still plenty of churches down here in the deep south that prohibit that sort of thing. As a matter of fact, there are plenty of Muslim groups that incorporate music and dance in their services. Throughout the Muslims world, many mosques use music to accompany the adhan every day. In fact, there are entire genres of music that have developed within the Arab world that are based around Islamic beliefs.
Football (what we'd call soccer) is wildly popular in most predominantly-Muslim countries and it was one of the first things that Muslims in Afghanistan re-established after the US initially kicked the taliban out of some areas.
Sooo, what point were you trying to make?
Simply wondering if you know the difference between fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims, bint, because there actually are.
And the only thing I doubt is your knowledge of Christian churches.
Morgan,
There are many different kinds of Christian churches.
I was raised in a fundamentalist Pentecostal denomination which would never have allowed dancing in church, and would likely have disfellowshipped anyone noticed dancing OUTSIDE of church. The women wore dresses, not pants, and makeup of any kind was verboten.
Some similar churches have since relaxed that kind of rule. Others haven't.
In any case, it's this simple:
- Mosques may only be used for Muslim worship. Cordoba Center will allow interfaith services. Therefore it is not a mosque.
- Mosques must publicly broadcast the calls to prayer. Cordoba Center will not. Therefore it is not a mosque.
- Non-Muslims may not eat or sleep at mosques. Non-Muslims will be welcome to eat at Cordoba Center. Therefore it is not a mosque.
Nor is it at Ground Zero, as the photograph posted by Dondero makes reasonably clear and as my own legended Google Maps shot makes even more clear.
Morgan,
"Why am I not surprised you would say that?"
You don't know me from Adam, yet you're sitting there telling yourself that you know what a complete stranger was going to say before they said it.
"it's a shame you don't know enough about Christian churches in general."
Reading fail (again)! If you want to talk about Christian churches in general and how they compare to Muslim mosques in general, I'm more than happy and qualified to do so, but a bit of reading comprehension would go a long way in that conversation, too. This had zip to do with what these religions usually do. It was regarding Christianists and Islamists, not Christians and Muslims in general.
Kn@ppster, the point of the whole thing has to do with the location. To have an Islamic center of any kind so close to Ground Zero will be looked upon as a sign of Islamic conquest.
In addition, the idea of allowing an Islamic center of any kind is insensitive to the memories of the 9/11 victims, and their families.
Morgan,
"Simply wondering if you know the difference between fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims, bint, because there actually are."
Fundamentalist Christians=/=Christianists
Fundamentalist Muslims=/=Islamists
If YOU understood either of these religions, you'd stop conflating these groups as if they are the same thing. While you're busy wondering what I know, you're exposing how little you know.
You don't know me from Adam, yet you're sitting there telling yourself that you know what a complete stranger was going to say before they said it.
Bull. All I had to do was read your comment to warrant a response such as mine. I never implied I knew squat about you.
Reading fail (again)!
Once again, I seriously doubt it. Reading your comment, however, I wonder about you. In any event, it doesn't change the fact there is a difference between fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims (something I was trying to point out without much success, it seems).
If YOU understood either of these religions, you'd stop conflating these groups as if they are the same thing.
If YOU understood what I've actually written, you wouldn't write a comment like you just did.
While you're busy wondering what I know, you're exposing how little you know.
You're describing yourself, not me.
Kn@ppster,
you're absolutely right. Unfortunately, Eric and Morgan are too ignorant of both Christianity and Islam to be aware of these facts. Down here in Louisiana, I have plenty of friends who grew up in churches like the one you're talking about. Hell, my brother who is now a Muslims was once Christian, but he was disfellowshipped from his old denomination because he admitted to being a cigarette smoker. Compared to his old denomination, being a Muslim is a piece of cake!
Morgan,
"I never implied I knew squat about you."
"Why am I not surprised you would say that?"
Please make up your mind. If you can't even keep track of your own comments, you certainly won't ever reach the level of reading comprehension necessary to figure out that Christianists=/=Christians and Islamists=/=Muslims
Your own comments prove that you confused the two from the very beginning. If you didn't know squat about me, yet you thought that you could predict what I would say, then you're claiming to be a psychic. Now, I'm totally cool with it if that's a part of your religious beliefs. It may not be a part of mainstream Lutheranism, but that's no reason to feel ashamed of your beliefs.
It's okay to admit that you had no idea about the fact that Muslims have a long, long history of incorporating dance and music in their worship and beliefs. It's okay that you didn't know about the wide variety of beliefs held by modern-day churches. Anyone who reads this thread can tell.
If you didn't know squat about me, yet you thought that you could predict what I would say, then you're claiming to be a psychic.
You know from my comments why I wrote the phrase "Why am I not surprised you would say that?" (from having read one of your comments beforehand), and yet you're making this absurd assertion about me. Good grief.
Now, I'm totally cool with it if that's a part of your religious beliefs. It may not be a part of mainstream Lutheranism, but that's no reason to feel ashamed of your beliefs.
Now look who's claiming to know me, even though they have never met me. And judging from the last paragraph of your comment, I'd say you are the one who can't keep track of your comments.
Morgan, where you fail is that you assume Knapp has any sensitivities for the 9/11 victims. Remember, he sides with those who want to destroy America. So, to a person like Knapp, those killed on 9/11 are just "expendable." Means to an end, which is the eventual conquest of the United States by its enemies.
Morgan,
you thought that reading one of my comments was enough for you to be able to predict what I was going to say, but you also admit that you don't know squat about me. If you don't think that's a psychic claim, then you obviously have no understanding of what the word "psychic" means.
By the way, if you think I've made an inconsistent comment, feel free to point out how that is so. Otherwise, you might do better spending your time actually educating yourself about the world around you. Ignorance is never cute in adults.
Anyway, I finally got my hottub working again, after being out of order for two years.
It's hot as shit here in Houston. Jumping in the "cold tub," with a Miller lite. You all can solve all the world's problems tonight without me.
Eric - from beautiful tropical Hosuton, Texas
Eric,
since some of those 9/11 families actually support the building of this center, your opinion certainly doesn't represent anything that takes into consideration their sensitivities. By the way, there were 9/11 victims were Muslims and Jews, there's no reason to believe that you represent those who were killed either.
bint, I never predicted squat about you at all. Your comprehension (or lack of) astounds me.
Morgan,
Your ignorance about a religion that you CLAIM to belong to doesn't astound me. It's pretty much par for the course when it comes to those who are protesting this community center.
It's pretty much par for the course when it comes to those who are protesting this community center.
Reading that last line makes me pity you. All the best to you.
The endless bitching on religion:
"Looked at sky through smoke heavy with human fat and God was not there. The cold, suffocating dark goes on forever and we are alone. Live our lives, lacking anything better to do. Devise reason later. Born from oblivion; bear children, hell-bound as ourselves, go into oblivion. There is nothing else."
"Existence is random. Has no pattern save what we imagine after staring at it for too long. No meaning save what we choose to impose. This rudderless world is not shaped by vague metaphysical forces. It is not God who kills the children. Not fate that butchers them or destiny that feeds them to the dogs. It is us. Only us."
Morgan,
those who think education is something to be pitied give me the lulz.
Never!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not wrong on this issue and you are wrong. You Eric shouldn't be allowed to call yourself a Libertarian or even and American with this type of attitude. You are just as bad as any other Democrat,because you don't care about freedom. You like economic freedom you know the good of Capitalism like myself. You like a lot of social freedom same here.
Yet you oppose something you simple don't like that doesn't do anything to harm you.
I have lived in New York my whole life I remember the day it happened. My father was a doctor who drove down that day to operate on those injured,I had 2 uncles and 1 aunt who were cops that day,and I have friend who's father was killed on 9/11.
So don't dare question my love for this nation and my hatred for what went on that day. The simple truth is we are Americans!!!!!! The simple truth is we are a free people who as long as you don't harm another human being you can't have your liberties taken away from you.
**** The simple truth is we are a free people who as long as you don't harm another human being you can't have your liberties taken away from you. ****
Wow. Now there is a person living in fantasy la-la land. Tell that to what is left of the American Indians.
"where you fail is that you assume Knapp has any sensitivities for the 9/11 victims."
Far more sensitivity than you do, Dondero.
I've spent the last nine years (and then some) fighting their enemies, the ones who killed them and the ones who willfully set up the context for them to be killed, both at home and abroad.
You've spent the last nine years pissing on their graves and attempting to co-opt them for your anti-freedom, anti-American agenda. This fraudulent "ground zero mosque" bullshit is just your latest insult to them.
You're a disgrace to your country, and to the uniform you once wore. Whether that's because you've completely forgotten what it means to be an American, or whether you know but have consciously turned against it, I know and care not.
those who think education is something to be pitied give me the lulz.
I'd ask you what that word means, but my reading comprehension is sooo poor (that was sarcasm, in case you weren't able to understand that).
Knapp, you've spent the last 9 years of your life living off a governent paycheck. Sitting on your fat ass in front of a computer typing up your loser 200 visitors a day blog.
Yes, I do know your secret. Let's just say a little birdie tapped on my window and told me all about your living off the government.
Hey Charles, and what about the rights of Marijuana smokers? Prostitutes? "Loose women"? Swingers? Gays?
I know you Paleo fucks don't give a flip about the civil liberties side of libertarianism. So, I don't expect you to aswer the question.
But just for the record: CIVIL LIBERTIES WILL NOT EXIST UNDER SHARIA LAW.
I'm the one standing up for Legalized prostitution, gays, marijuana smokers, swingers, booze, gambling, ect... against this Muslim onslaught. And you Sir, have the audacity to say that I'm "no Libertarian."
Here's a little news for ya: Libertarianism isn't just about economic liberties: IT'S ABOUT CIVIL LIBERTIES TOO, INCLUDING SEXUAL LIBERTIES!!
Mr. Dondero,
You are a liar.
The last check I received from ANY government was more than ten years ago, and that was a refund of excess tax payments.
Between 1984 and 1995, I received periodic paychecks from the US Marine Corps for services rendered.
I've never applied for, nor have I ever received, any government payments of the "welfare" or disability" sort, nor do I ever intend to.
If you want to continue repeating this lie about me, you might want to start thinking about your choice of weapons and whom you'd like to have as your second, because it WILL result in a challenge.
Thank you very much for the linkage, dude.
Eric you have no brains if you don't think I care about the civil liberties of others.
Am I pro-gay? Proudly
Am I pro-choice? Yes it's not my right to decide.
Do I favor legalizing weed? Yes I do
Am I for abortion and do I smoke weed? No!
I tolerate others in away you can't possible do. Now do muslims do it? Not always yet you know what. Muslims died in 9/11 too. So maybe they deserve a mosque there to.
So just come down.
Oh yes and make my stance clear regarding loose women. I'm fine with prostitutes doing things and I want to help them by legalizing prostitution.
Yet you prance around on your page praising Sharron Angle. Who lets look at her record.
3. God chose me for this.
2. Make beer illegal
1. Father rape daughter "when God give you lemons you make lemonade"
You call that moron a Libertarian.
"Very nice graphic, which confirms what I just wrote and also shows the 21-story building and the 15-story building that separate "Ground Zero" from what will be a 13-story building."
Fvck that, Tom.
The dimensions of the site isn't limited to simple interpretations.
It would be petty triumphalism for this sect of Islam to install a mosque anywhere NEAR the dust and debris and the ashes of real human beings - a patch of sanctified Earth that includes a lot of buildings that didn't crumble - an area even larger than the aero-photo. Got that?
The stench of the burning - burning people, Tom - drifted north into our Upper West Side apartment for weeks, pal. Tell me with a straight face that all of Manhattan isn't part of it.
. . .
For those so cool with the mosque, you really ought to study sharia and the sick history of the trade in girls and women that still exists in Africa and Asia, a trade run by the same Barbarians that have run it since the 7th century.
Oh they'll have mixed dancing! Gee... how tolerant can ya get? Nifty! Can I build a synagogue in Mecca now?
Eric:
I am sorry for the way this is going to affect you, but your self-righteous rants, combined with your practical illiteracy, remind me of that line from "Men In Black" where Zed (Rip Torn) tells all those gung-ho military types:
[to candidates rejected as MIB agents]
Zed: Gentlemen, congratulations. You're everything we've come to expect from years of government training. [IMDB]
Eric, you & others like you are oh so eager to replace rational thought about our future as a race with irrational proclamations of self-superiority and xenophobia (go ahead and look that up, Eric-- the rest of us will wait until you get back...)
And as long as smug G.I.Joe-types like you can thump their chests and growl about "kickin' butt" and "bein' gooder'n the evil-doers", you think that you are relieved of any obligation to consider any opinion OTHER than your own! Worse still, you are so small-minded that you actually think that your REJECTION of opinions other than your own somehow serves to PROVE that you are better-- or at least more "American"-- than everyone else.
How pathetic!!!
I have some VERY bad news for you, my misanthropic friend: YOU are no more "AMERICAN" than any of the Afghani tribesmen who are risking their lives every day to help troops like my son & daughter-in-law (both Army Sgts on their FOURTH TOUR OF COMBAT) rid THEIR country of backward-ass bigots LIKE YOU!
How easy it must be for a seemingly-undereducated person like yourself to ignore HISTORY: it was barely 40 years ago that the "Tribal Regions" of the United States (Alabama, Mississippi, Florida, Texas, etc) were under the control of the "American Taliban" (the KKK)-- AND THEY WERE ALL SELF-RIGHTEOUS BIGOTS JUST LIKE YOU!!!
Oh, and PLEASE don't try to hide behind the lame excuse "That's just how I was raised..."
My Grandfather was Sheriff of one of those counties in Florida by day-- AND GRAND DRAGON OF THE LOCAL KLAVERN BY NIGHT!!!
My father, and my older brothers were led straight into that lifestyle...
Thankfully, my teen years fell AFTER the events forever memorialized by the movie "Mississippi Burning"--when it FINALLY became unpopular to openly espouse racism in public, even in the Heart of Dixie...
It took many years, but I WAS eventually able to un-learn that behavior and realize that America wasn't REALLY "infested" by huge groups of sub-humans-- and that God wasn't REALLY judging me by how much I hated "niggers" or "kikes" or "fags"...
In short, that MY FATHER & HIS FATHER & HIS FATHER WERE WRONG!!!
I am SO disappointed that this great nation of ours seems so timid & hesitant to get about the business of CRUSHING THE RECENTLY-REBORNING RACISM THAT BRINGS SUCH COMFORT TO RANTERS LIKE ERIC (& RUSH & BECK & BACHMAN & ANGLE &) ...
In the most ironic twist of this entire affair, THESE ARE THE SAME VOICES RAISED IN HOLY OUTRAGE when radical MUSLIMS (the "Erics of Islam") forbade the building of a CHRISTIAN CHURCH in the world's largest MUSLIM country (Indonesia).
THEY WERE FOAMING-AT-THE-MOUTH OUTRAGED THAT SUCH UNMITIGATED EVIL COULD STAND BETWEEN THEIR SAVIOR, THE SWEET LITTLE BABY JESUS, AND ALL THOSE UNWASHED HEATHENS WHO NEED HIM-- PRESUMABLY SO THAT THEY CAN FIND THE BLESSING & COMFORT OF BEING MORE LIKE ERIC!
And now the "Erics" in our midst can't even RECOGNIZE the same shoe when they see it again-- because NOW it's on THEIR foot!!!
AFTER BEING TOLD BY THE SITE SEVEN TIMES THAT THE PAGE "COULD NOT BE FOUND", I DISCOVERED THAT EVERY ONE OF THOSE ATTEMPTS HAD INSTEAD BEEN POSTED!!!
I would apologize for the appearance of impropriety on my part, except IT WAS YOUR SOFTWARE THAT FAILED!!!
So I won't...
Ran,
You write:
"The dimensions of the site isn't limited to simple interpretations."
In other words, facts are irrelevant, and whatever bullshit you make up is the new truth.
I see that Republican Surrealism ("We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality") is alive and well.
Right. Only your facts are relevant, it seems.
Fact: Your precious mapping of the site isn't shared by a lot of people who had to literally shovel their neighbors' ashes to clear debris.
Define "ground zero" any way you want, cherry pick any "facts" that fire either of your bourbon-impaired grey-cells.
The simple fact is that the proximity of this oh-so-holy mosque is seen by most New Yorkers and by mohammedans in the historical context of muslim triumphalism.
The building is right smack in the middle of the fvcking splash zone and will be seen by them - THEM - as a victory mosque. Go ahead and tell 'em all not to party so - "Hell, there's a 21 story building in the way, silly morons." Right. They apparently care even less what you think than we do.
What, next you'll claim that a bullet that rips thorough your shirt fabric but not your chest wasn't really aimed at *you*?
"The simple fact is that the proximity of this oh-so-holy mosque"
In order to be a "simple fact," something must first be a fact.
Since it's not a mosque, it's not a fact. Since it's not a fact, it's not a "simple fact."
Thanks for playing, loonytunes. Next?
Ran I hate to tell you this, but Knapp is right; you are wrong.
It is not really a "Mosque," that is being proposed for Ground Zero. It's more appropriately described as an Al Qaead-linked Hamas Terrorist Training Center. Pamela Geller and others have painstakingly researched the background of Rauf, or Sauf or whatever the fuck his name is. His ties to Terrorism are a mile long.
So, when Knapp says, "it's not a Mosque." He's actually right on that. Sure, it will have the appearance of a Mosque, outside facade, function the same way as a Mosque. But in reality it will be the first foot in the door for Al Qaeda here in the United States.
Hey Ric, you dumbshit, we'll accept that your a Newbie to this blogging thing. You get one pass. Now how about going back through that mountain of posts of the same shit, and deleting all but one of them?
Eric - the Management
Oh, you looking for racism? Look to radical Islam. They hate us for who we are as a people; our freedoms, our sexual liberation, our free market economics, our open lifestyle, and free speech.
Doesn't matter if you're black, white, red, yellow. If you've got an 'A' by your name, as in AMERICAN, you are a target of Al Qaeda's racism.
Oh, and incidentally THAT INCLUDES MUSLIM AMERICANS, at least 100 of them died in the Towers on 9/11.
Here is a wonderful group that I fully support. I've had the leader of the group Ali Hasan, on the show "Libertarian Politics Live," a couple years ago.
Perhaps its time we have him on again.
http://www.muslimsforamerica.us/
Oh, and just in case you were wondering, Ali IS A REPUBLICAN!
Eric, Tom,
"I hate to tell you this, but..." both of you are wrong. It is not purely a mosque prayer space, but the site contains a mosque, dudes. That is the entire point of the site. That is why it has an immam.
Hard, irrefutable fact: The development contains a mosque.
As the "cultural center" evolves over time, likely more and more of it will "upgrade" to sharia-compliant prayer space. EVEN WITHOUT THAT, IT CONTAINS WHAT THEY - *THEY* - SEE AS THE NECESSARY INGREDIENT.
Tom plays fast and loose with reality when his tidy definitions don't comport with it. This isn't about Tom's precious view, it's about THEIR'S, dudes.
If you don't see what they see, you aren't seeing the target. Don't give us this bullshit about the site not *really* being a mosque. Right - and DisneyWorld isn't a *really* restaurant, either.
As for the "first" foot in the door for AQ? This is a first? What THEY distinguish between training space, cultural space and mosque? What's next, they're into separation of mosque and state, too? Learn something new every day.
Eric your perhaps the worst Libertarian I've ever seen.
Hmmn? I happen to think I'm the best Libertarian I've ever seen.
And many would agree. Take a stroll on over to the About Page for this website, click up top. You'll see scores and scores of lauduatory comments from my fans.
No problem if you don't want to be included in FOEs (Friends of Eric). I'm already overloaded.
Peralo, Sharron Angle has clarified her remarks on the previous statement on beer. She is absolutely 100% Pro-Beer. She was interviewed by John Gizzi of Human Events two months ago, and stated that categorically. She misspoke in that original interview, and stated as such.
You should know that when she first won the nomination I was a bit skeptical of her, and said so right here on this blog. In fact, we were very critical of the Beer thing in a lengthy article.
I tend to think that it was our article here, and Sharron's desire to reach out to libertarians, that led Gizzi to interview her, and specifically ask her about the beer issue.
Ran,
"For those so cool with the mosque, you really ought to study sharia and the sick history of the trade in girls and women that still exists in Africa and Asia, a trade run by the same Barbarians that have run it since the 7th century."
Perhaps you should study the sick history of the trade in girls and women that still exists in the United States--a trade run by the same group of barbarians that have been doing it ever since they came to this country after leaving countries where their ancestors also practiced it.
I've studied sharia for over a decade. I've forgotten more about the Muslim world than you could ever even learn. If you knew jack shit about sharia, you'd know that, according to it, this center doesn't even qualify as a mosque. But, hey, why let the facts get in the way, right?
"This isn't about Tom's precious view, it's about THEIR'S, dudes."
Precisely.
The "they" in "THEIR'S" [sic] is radical Wahabe Islamists.
Per "THEIR" doctrine, it's not a mosque if it doesn't issue the adhan (call to prayer) to the public.
Per "THEIR" doctrine, it's not a mosque if it allows any non-Muslim worship.
Per "THEIR" doctrine, it's not a mosque if non-Muslims are allowed to eat or sleep there.
So, it's only a "mosque" to those who either ignore or don't bother to know what a mosque IS to THE PEOPLE THEY CLAIM ARE TRYING TO BUILD ONE.
So the question, Ran, is are you an idiot, a liar, or both? Those are the only three possible conclusions.
MY APOLOGIES TO ALL FOR THE CASCADING REPETITIVE SENDS OF THE SAME POST.
As I noted at the time, the software kept returning the error message: "Page cannot be found", so I tried various minor modifications of the "send" variables-- to the effect that you saw.
Again, I apologize...
NOW, PERHAPS ERIC CAN COME OUT FROM BEHIND THAT FLIMSY TECHNO-BLIND AND REPLY TO WHAT MUST BE (TO HIM) AN AGONIZING DOSE OF REALITY.....?
Ric,
I get the same message from time to time with Eric's blog. He's fucked with the html so much that this blog gets really screwy sometimes.
I can't believe there's even a discussion about this on a "Libertarian" site. The proposed mosque is to be built on private property and is NOT publicly funded, right? Who gives a rat's ass.
Anonymous,
Even a cursory look at this blog proves that this blog isn't at ALL libertarian. If it was, I probably wouldn't get so bored with it.
Hey, Eric, I'm a vietnam vet - rode shotgun in dustoff missions - now tell me about your "American manhood." I am also a libertarian, one who thinks that rights are not conferred by the government or by the mob. As soon as someone presumes to tell someone else what they can do with their private property, they lose the right to call themselves libertarian and become just another statist.
OK, everyone is being used to fight eavh other when its just to get us to reduce the population. I believe in the laws of physics, more than the ones governments approve. Physics are based on reality, the government is based on money. So The Bush administration, Cheney mostly, took advantage of us all and pulverized 5 foot square supports which woulda fallen onto other buildings around GZ and the bomb aquad cleaned up their own work... Then Cheney made BILLIONS off of the contracts he gave his company. This is all to distract you from the real issue that we are all the same underneath all this hatred and exclusionary BS, muslims accept christians and are all related to people worshiping the same GOD!!!! they dont like us importing our culture into their ancient culture. Get over it and open up to the truth that the muslims and "US[AH]" are mad for the EXACT SAME REASON!! They think they are right to push away what is different and that they fear....
Universal Family is all that matters.
Just get over what separates us and them, that there is an us and them.
9/11 was an inside job.There were no planes.Watch 911 Taboo and September Clues for the truth.
wow... Eric, good job.. you are an ignorant, hateful hillbilly that doesnt understand the first thing about freedom- which doesnt surprise me because ur republican. This was NOT the most important issue of that DAY, let alone year or lifetime. NOT A MOSQUE, NOT GROUND ZERO, NO ISLAMIC VICTORY OVER AMERICA!!!!
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