Monday, August 13, 2007

A vote for Ron Paul is a vote for Hillary's Socialized Health Care

by David Catron

In 1992, Bill Clinton was elected President because 19% of the voters were naive enough to pull the lever for a certified wackjob: Ross Perot. Looking at the results of the Ames straw poll, I have a sinking feeling that history may repeat itself in 2008.

In the straw poll, Ron Paul garnered 9% of the vote. This confirms that he has virtually no chance of becoming the Republican presidential nominee. Unfortunately, it also confirms that he is capable of siphoning a significant number votes away from more credible candidates.

Here’s why this gives me the “willies”: Once it becomes clear to Paul that he hasn’t a prayer of getting the Republican nod, he may well run for President on the Libertarian ticket (as he did in 1988). He won’t get the number of votes that Perot received, but it won’t take that many to guarantee Hillary’s election.

As in Perot’s case, almost all of Paul’s support in a general election would come from voters who would otherwise (though perhaps reluctantly) vote Republican. Because the major party candidates will likely be within a couple of percentage points of one another, even a 5% showing for Dr. Paul would cinch it for Clinton.

So, if you like the idea of government-run health care, you should get in there and work your heart out for Ron Paul. His candidacy constitutes Hillarycare’s best hope.

*Note - David Catron is a Medical Financial Specialist living in Georgia.


KineticReaction said...

That was the worst article I've ever read. Ron Paul is the only hope for Western civilization. Both Republican and Democrats are run by same special interests (big oil, arms makers, AIPAC) and are promising the same wasteful social programs to buy votes that are running the country into the ground.

Eric Dondero said...

Blame it on "those Jews" at AIPAC 'eh?

David Duke is supporting Ron Paul. At least you've got some company.

And you wonder why some are suspicious of Ron Paul Supporters' ties to far out anti-Semitic racist groups?

Ken Hamilton said...

I hope Ron Paul does decide to run for the LP presidential nomination.

I will not vote - even reluctantly - for the GOP presidential nominee) in 2008.

And, frankly, if it comes to Senator Clinton vs. former Mayor Giuliani I hope that Senator Clinton wins as I think that she will do less damage to liberty in these United States. What's left of conservatives in this country would rise up and oppose a President Clinton while they would let a President Giuliani continue to destroy liberty in this nation as they have President Bush - simply because he is a Republican.

Eric Dondero said...

Problem with your scenario is that under Clinton, conservatives or libertarians will no longer exist.

Look what Bill Clinton started to do in the 1990s to the Right. He burned 80 "crazy right wingers" alive at Waco, had his Agents shoot to death a few more in Idaho, and then he blamed a couple "right-wing gun nuts" for the Oklahoma City bombing to divert attention from the Radical Muslims who were behind it.

You don't think it's going to be that same sort of stuff under his wife?

They're already threatening to outlaw talk radio with the Fairness Doctrine.

G.E. Smith said...

Eric - The major problem with the thesis of this article is that it assumes that people who would vote for a third-party Paul candidacy would otherwise vote for the Republican candidate. You know that to be false. A large percentage would vote Libertarian/Constitution anyway. Another segment would vote for the Democrats in the absence of Paul's campaign. The Anti-War Left, for example, would support Ron Paul at least as much as right-leaning would-be Republican voters. In fact, a Ron Paul third-party / independent candidacy might actually help the GOP get elected if there were any chance of that happening, which there isn't. Get ready for Madam President, Eric.

Godwhacker said...

Your logic is as bad as ever Eric. Ron Paul still does have a chance. The real fact of the matter is that without him, The Republican Party has no chance.

Why? The war. Please don't boar me with you GOP talking points. The county is notably anti-war at the moment. 70% of Americans think invading Iraq was a mistake, and that number is bound to increase over the next year as the cost in blood and treasure goes higher.

Paul voted against the war and he takes the war issue away from the Democrats. He is the only Republican that can beat them. You are working for the Democrats with every disparaging word you use against Ron Paul.

But your anyone but Paul rant is getting old. You are obviously a shill for those who see Paul as a real danger to their hold on power. But you're not even a very good shill. You want to run for Congress? If I were your campaign adviser, I'd tell you to shut this blog down ASAP.

Your words will be as ghosts when they come back to haunt you.

Eric Dondero said...

I guess you missed the news this morning, huh? You really ought to check Yahoo News or Drudge before you start posting.

There's a brand new CBS poll out showing support for the War in Iraq among Americans is way up from July.

Americans answered the poll that they think there's definite progress from the Surge.

Ken Hamilton said...

You mean all the way up to 29%, Eric.

Wow! I'm impressed!


Ken Hamilton said...

"Problem with your scenario is that under Clinton, conservatives or libertarians will no longer exist."

Baloney, Eric.

Libertarians and conservatives would be under more threat from a Rudy "freedom is about authority" Giuliani administration than a Hillary Clinton administration.

Ryan said...

"Godwhacker" uses name calling to substitute for facts. Words like "shill" add nothing of note or substance to a debate and detract only from the individual who uses this illegitimate debating "technique" and not the person to whom the name is being directed toward. Wars tend not to be popular endeavors, but true leadership is about making and supporting difficult decisions, not popularity contests.
"Godwhacker", and respectfully, Ken, can vote for the "Libertarian" Party. Waste your votes and firmly root yourselves further in the political wilderness of American politics. What was the last national election the Libertarian Party won in the United Sates? Oh, yeah, I forget. None.

The party is run by such extremists at the helm that Americans will never elect a libertarian if the inmates continue to run the asylum as it were at the LP. I hope the Libertarian Reform Caucus continues its push so that perhaps, someday, a true libertarian can hold office under the libertarian label without being attacked and ravaged by the pack of wolves from his own political party. Oh, that's right, the "Libertarian Party" wasn't created to actually win elections. Which justifies its existence for precisely what purpose?

Godwhacker said...

Shill –noun
1. a person who poses as a customer in order to decoy others into participating, as at a gambling house, auction, confidence game, etc.
2. a person who publicizes or praises something or someone for reasons of self-interest, personal profit, or friendship or loyalty.
–verb (used without object)
3. to work as a shill: He shills for a large casino.
–verb (used with object)
4. to advertise or promote (a product) as or in the manner of a huckster; hustle: He was hired to shill a new TV show.

Pretty accurate if you ask me. Support for the war is up? With what you are smoking, I suggest you fall right in line behind Ron Paul. Giuliani will give you 10 to 12 for that.

BTW: When/if I do call you names, you'll know it.

Eric Dondero said...

Godwhacker, you fail to consider that the poll cited was done by USAToday, a leftwing extremist rag if there every was one.

USAToday has been ruthlessly anti-Bush/anti-War in Iraq. If they're even admitting that support for the War is up in their poll to 29%, no doubt the real number is much more than that, 39%, maybe even higher?

When dealing with America-hating media institutions like USA Today, Washington Post, NY Times, Newsweek, Time, you always have to include a big fudge factor with their polls.

Remember all those past elections, where they always had Democrats ahead and Republicans ended up winning big?

Godwhacker said...

Eric, keep living in your dream world. The fact is, we have no business in Iraq anymore than China had running our ports. We will only be seen as occupiers and the war will never go well because it is not a just war.

I say that not because I hate America. I say that because I love America.

The America I believe in leads the world on human rights and doesn't run secret prisons.

The America I believe in is the defender of liberty, not the perverter of it.

The America I believe in is the land of the free and the home of the brave, not the land of the coward and the home of the slave.

The America I believe in is a democratic republic, not an empire.

Look at the stock-market today Eric. The credit crunch is driving the economy into a tail-spin. Where is all that credit Eric? The 2 billion dollars a week we borrow from China to keep this failed war going is starting to have an effect on main street.

The bubble of your little world is getting ready to pop, so dream on. Reality will hit you like a brick wall.

Eric Dondero said...

The America you describe is a Sissy Boy weak-ass America.

What you are basically describing is an America just like Canada, where all the Men are like Women, where Political Correctness rules, and the Army is made up of a bunch of pansy-ass overweight Pansys.

I've seen Canadian Army dudes, and you would not believe how out-of-shape and weak looking they are.

Yup, what you're proposing is basically the institution of Gilie Man America.

No chance for American men to prove themselves on the battlefield. Never fight any Wars to protect the homeland. Just talk and negotiate with Terrorists.

Sorry Charlie, but I was born a man, and I support masculinity and masculine values.

The Femi-Nazis have succeeded in convincing guys like you to cut off your penises.

Ain't gonna happen with this ex-Navy Boy.

Godwhacker said...

Now get ready to be insulted. The America I love is the strong America. That is the American that can take a punch in the nose like 9/11 without shredding the constitution and murdering women and children in response. It is the America that knows a cowardly little group of thugs hiding in a cave pose no serious threat to our national security.

It is the America that you stand for that is the bully, and we all know that bullies are really cowards at heart. So while you want to "bomb Iran", I want to fight in the battlefield of ideas. Liberty and freedom are more than just words Eric, they actually mean something. "Girlie man"? You couldn't walk down my streets you sniveling little coward, so go and run behind your neo-fascist masters wimp.

Come now folks! The freak show is open! Everything that is wrong and ugly in America today has been distilled down into one shivering sack of nothing and it's name is Eric Dondero.

Eric Dondero said...

Nice spin. But any way you look at it, running away from a fight, after someone else has attacked you, is defined as being a Pussy.

Whether in the school yard, or in the global sphere. If you don't fight you're a Sissy Boy at best, an emasculated male turned scared little girl at worst.

Todd and in Charge said...

I thought in a democracy you should vote for who you want to win; the author of the article would have you compromise your beliefs and sublimate your views in order to achieve some collective "good" that is less than what you believe is best or most desirable.

Sorry no sale.

Ken Hamilton said...

"Waste your votes and firmly root yourselves further in the political wilderness of American politics."

Well, ryan, I've been in the political wilderness since I embrace libertarianism in 1980. So it's not something new to me. :-)

Ken Hamilton said...

"Sorry Charlie, but I was born a man, and I support masculinity and masculine values."

So, Eric, why aren't you over in Iraq putting your masculinity and masculine values where your keyboard is?

Eric Dondero said...

Already done my time thank you. 4 long years Sea Duty in the United States Navy. Two tours in a War Zone (upper Persian Gulf during the Iraq/Iran War). 3 medals including Expeditionary for service in a War Zone.

4 years is enough. I had no plans to be a lifer dog.

My time in the Navy?

"Twas the best of times, twas the worst of times..."

Once in a lifetime is more than enough.

Godwhacker said...

The name is "Godwhacker", Eric. I don't run from anything. Not terrorists in caves, nor pot-bellied dwarfs with a Hitler complex. I don't need random acts of violence to make me a man. I was born this way.

curtis fenimore said...

For those keeping score at home it was Eric who called the AIPAC "those jews"

Eric what part of that CBS poll are you referring to? Are we looking at the same poll? oh is it the 5% drop in people who want to either decrease the number of troops or pull out all troops (66% down to 61%)? Real bright spot, that one.

Also, do you support any candidate, or just work to discredit Ron Paul, the only candidate who cares about the constitution, the country and the citizens?

Ryan said...

I wanted to clarify my comments the other night to Ken. I respect your devotion to your ideals and staying loyal to the Libertarian Party. I personally cannot be a member of the LP with its current foreign policy/defense positions. That's my personal position. My comments directed to Ken might have been overly harsh upon reflection. Sometimes one man standing up to the winds of tyranny in the political wilderness is exactly what's called for. You have my respect for that, Ken.

Yours In Liberty,
Ryan :)

Morerice said...

Godwhacker writes...
"Come now folks! The freak show is open! Everything that is wrong and ugly in America today has been distilled down into one shivering sack of nothing and it's name is Eric Dondero."

That is funny! And oh so true.